146 - Visibility Challenges with Jen Uschold LLC

[00:00:00] Hey guys. Welcome back to the MaYapinion Podcast. I'm your host, Maya Roffler, and today I have another incredible founder with me. I have Jen, us with me. Jen, welcome to the MaYapinion Podcast. Thank you. I'm very excited to be here. I'm excited to have you. And so Jen is the founder of Jen Usol, LLC. Lots going on with this business, Jen, and you've got.

Over 25, 30 years of experience in the physical therapy, the wellness space. Tell us a little bit about your business and then we're gonna share some business challenges as well. But we first wanna talk about your business. So excited. Absolutely. Well, as a physical therapist, I'm actually 35 years in and yes, it's been a long time and I remember my very first job in Pennsylvania.

I had one particular client in general and I did not know. How to help him? [00:01:00] I was kind, I was connected. I used what I could, but I couldn't understand why his pain was better when he went on vacation. I couldn't understand why stress made his pain worse, and he never left my mind, but I never had any ways to help him.

So we're gonna fast forward way into around 2014 or so I had a client say, Hey, why don't you just come home with me and you can just coach me along the way. And I said, well, I don't think my kids are like that. However, that kind of got this coaching bug going. So it was then that I started pursuing.

I am a national board certified health and wellness coach and also around that time I got exposed to pain science, which literally. Blew my mind. All of the things that I didn't understand. Now we had the science to explain it, and so I've also completed a fellowship in pain science. So bringing the coaching and the pain together has really broadened how it is that I can help [00:02:00] clients.

I worked for hospitals all along the way. And I lived in Indiana and in 2006 I had a neighbor come to me and he said, I'm having a total hip replacement and I want you to do my physical therapy. And I said, well, I don't do that. I happen to be on maternity leave. And he kind of flippantly said, well, you do now.

I was like. Oh, so that actually was the beginning of me having my own business. And then when I moved to Virginia, where I am now, I put that on pause 'cause I was raising three small little people. Got a regular job very upfront. I'm building this business on the side. They were very supportive of that and so that was great.

Just. Puttering along, and then again, 2014 or so, I was able to go out completely on my own. I'm now integrating the coaching. I'm now integrating the pain science, and this is when I just was starting to get a little bit of flow. And then 2020 happened, and that is when I ended up going through a contentious divorce and [00:03:00] suddenly the reliable income that he had is no longer there.

So that has been the push for me to really grow my business. And in 2022, I actually took all of my pain science and lifestyle medicine work, and I applied it to my own divorce. And so I thought, huh. This is not only helpful for people struggling with back pain, hip pain, shoulder pain, I can now apply this to significant life transitions.

So I did that and that where, that is where the LLC Iris for me came from. And then just this past year I thought, you know, I'm gonna put it all in one umbrella. And that's when I created Jenna Sult, LLC. I love it. Thank you. What a wonderful recap. And what a wealth of knowledge you are over 35 years of experience.

Lemme ask you this, Jen. , So again, lots going on. I know you have a physical therapy business. I know you have a coaching business, speaking. We're gonna get into all of that. And kind of where we're wanting to focus [00:04:00] today to propel you forward, but I wanna ask. It's interesting your career because it's, you've had a focus on physical pain and then it's.

Evolved for you from what I was reading on your site and learning more about you and as you shared about the evolution of this and also with your divorce. I relate to this too because physical pain manifested a lot for me in mine. So it feels like you've evolved over the years. Like, okay, we started with the physical therapy and then it became

obviously you have a strong connection with your clients. If they're telling you, come to my house. No, I want you. Right? So we don't have to worry about that with you, Jen. You connect with people very deeply. Right. That's phenomenal. Well, I mean, it's, it's evident in your stories, right? So I'm curious with the work that you're doing, it's not just physical pain is what I'm getting at, right?

It's also emotional and it's, I don't know, is it all tied together? Talk me through that a little bit and what you do. That is such a beautiful question because people think [00:05:00] pain is just physical, but the reality is. All pain is physical and emotional. We cannot separate it out. And the big fancy word is bio psychosocial.

All pain does have biology. It also has psychology. It also has sociology. And the reality is pain is so complex, it actually involves every system of your body. And now for someone who sprained their ankle yesterday, just walking down the sidewalk, getting their mail. The biology piece of their pie is going to be quite big.

The psychology and sociology probably gonna be a little bit smaller now if that same person is still having severe pain two months, two years, two decades later, well now that biology piece of their pie is much smaller and we have to get much more curious about the psychology and the social cultural factors because they all contribute to pain.

And it's a really good [00:06:00] time to say that all pain is real. We have never the faint, the pain scientists, the very smart people. We've never scanned fake pain, and we have to get more curious about what its sources are so that we can create the best treatment plan to ease it, and it's not chasing tissues.

That very helpful and I love what you're saying about Yeah. I mean, when you're first injured, of course.

As time goes on, we heal, our bodies heal. We're seeing, you know, doctors, medical professionals to help with that. So we have to get to the root cause. Tell us a little bit about your coaching. So if I'm someone, I'm, I guess I'll just use me as an example. I've, I had chronic back pain for a really long time.

Sometimes I still struggle from it, from multiple car accidents. I found that for me. As time went on, you kind of tapped into this already. As time went on, it would manifest under stressful times through to my divorce. [00:07:00] I had miscarriages IVF stuff, like different things like that. Stressful work times loss.

When I went through, you know, a. Death of my brother. Lots of things, lots of big things in my life. We all have big things in our life, but I notice physical manifestation happening through that. Tell me about your coaching, Jen. Is that what you do? Like, who is your client and who comes to you, when they're in pain?

Because I, I know it's not just when someone breaks their, you know, ankle and like they need physical therapy. You have different modalities and different things that you do in your business. So talk to us about that. So with the coaching, people are often a little bit hesitant or curious because how can I help them with pain in their shoulder if we are doing this virtually or you're in another country?

Well, the reality is there are three main things that the research is very clear on to help people that have been navigating pain for a long time. The first is education. We are operating on [00:08:00] a model that is 370 years old. The way most clinicians and people are addressing pain literally goes back almost 400 years.

So we have the science, we just need to disseminate it, and we do this through simple stories to help people understand the complexities of pain in a way they can understand. So that's number one. And, um. Probably the simplest little tidbit I could give you there is that your nervous system is like a very high tech alarm, and if you step on a nail, we want to feel that so that we can take it out, clean our foot, make sure our tetanus is up to date, and then as you said.

Those tissues heal. The challenge is that about one in four people, their nervous system doesn't get back to its baseline. And so the easiest way to understand this is, let's just say that I throw a brick through your front window. Do you want your house alarm to go off? Yes, of course. Now, if somebody [00:09:00] messed with the sensitivity of the alarm and a leaf hit your window and your house alarm went off, is your house okay?

It is. It is. And so then this, you already had the light bulb moment, Maya, but I asked my clients, is it possible that your house, that your body's okay and we need to focus on the sensitivity of the alarm? And we drew that with science and art. So that's number one. Education. It's very cool. We actually have over two dozen systematic reviews and meta-analysis, high science, telling us that when people understand pain.

They have less pain, but it is not a standalone treatment. The next thing that we really need to do is help people move. People tend to either avoid movement because they're afraid of pain, or people are like, oh, we're just gonna bust through it. No pain, no gain. Neither one of these works, and they can actually make pain worse.

So we're finding that beautiful middle [00:10:00] ground of enough movement to help calm the nervous system down. And then the third area is powering down the nervous system. And that is a host of 20 plus options that is driven by the client. Okay, yeah, let's try some yoga, let's try some nutrition. Sleep is important.

And so then we are creating a unique program for each person, and I've kind of put those three together into Empower UE Education M. Motion. Motion is lotion and P powering down the nervous system. I love that and I connect with that because for me, when I was going through severe back pain from a really bad accident that I had mentioned briefly earlier, I didn't wanna move.

I would, and that really I gained a lot of weight from it. I was on steroid injections, I had back procedures done, and they kept telling me like, you have to move. And I would go to physical therapy, and then the physical therapy would be so. Traumatizing for my body at the time, and then it got easier with time, but it would take so much out of me.

I [00:11:00] wouldn't consistently move when I wasn't going to that. So I love that you combined all of that. And so I think it kind of answers my next question before we start to get into your challenges that you're facing right now. But one additional question, just so our audience is really clear and we know.

How do we know if we can work with you, Jen? I think for me, what I'm taking away from this right now is if it's some, God, it's almost like me a few years ago, if I'm in physical pain, but I'm not, you know, my, again, you don't, it's you're healed. You're not broken anymore, like the bone isn't broken or you've gone through your surgery, but you're still facing the pain.

Or maybe it's somebody who has physical pain and has not really gotten a proper diagnosis like people are saying, you know, well this is, you know, I think you. Kind of break down in these three areas, how they can move through this and implement this in their everyday lifestyle. That's kind of what I'm understanding.

Is that correct? Yes. I always tell my clients the goal is to fire me [00:12:00] because they're doing well and they have the tools to navigate, and then they can always contact me if they need additional help. This is why we talk about treating pain rather than managing pain. And we treat a cold, right?

We have more water, we get more sleep, whatever it is, and then it's gone and it might come again. We know what to do versus managing, we manage type one diabetes, it's not gonna go away. So it's a different energy behind those two phrases. Pain treatment, pain management, and we're really trying to treat the pain.

And you had asked who is a good candidate? Yeah, mostly someone who is curious. To understand more about their situation and also be a very active participant in the program. Because I don't tell people what to do. I provide information. If they welcome it, we come up with strategies [00:13:00] and then they choose what they're gonna do.

And how long does your relationship typically last? How long do you think it's effective to work with someone? And it sounds quite personal, like someone might need you for a year, some people might need you for a few years, some people might need you for a few months, like, but what are you finding typically with clients?

Yeah. , You nailed it. There is no typical, and it is a co-creation, like our relationship. It is a co-creation. Both of us, how we're showing up and interacting is a driver of what the results will be and. Everybody has a unique story and so you were talking about some of your challenges and you know, if somebody has one or two challenges, well that's gonna be easier to address than somebody who is coming in after having pain for 30 years.

They've had 7, 8, 12 diagnoses, they've had six surgeries, and if they have really, really strong beliefs about pain that are [00:14:00] misguided, that's a client who's gonna take a little bit longer and. Needs to be willing to be a little bit more curious. Totally makes sense. Yeah, totally. Unless versus someone coming in, going, I'm ready.

Just give me all the answers. I'm ready. I'm just totally Oh, all those people. Yes, I know. Isn't that always the best client, regardless of who you're catering to? All of you listening know when you get those clients that are like, I'm ready. I'm all in. That's like. The dream, right? Yeah. Yeah. So, Jen, let's shift gears a little bit, and obviously what I do here, as you guys know, is we highlight your business and then I give my opinion on how I can help.

So you've got so much experience. It sounds like you've got some great programs. I know your PT business is thriving and doing really well, which is more of your in-person business, but you were keen to talk a little bit more about coaching and speaking today. So tell me a little bit about those challenges that you're facing.

Yeah, I think the one sentence summary is I don't know how to get my [00:15:00] message out there effectively enough to have people raise their hands and say, yes, I want this. And it's similar for both the coaching and the speaking. I have tried. Many different strategies. I've worked with some amazing coaches, I've done several programs, and so I'm just not quite sure where the mismatch is.

Sure. Because I have the passion. I have the motivation. I have a very strong message that I wanna get out to the world. And what are your thoughts, Maya? Help me get it out there. I'm gonna give my opinion, so let's dive into it. Yes, let's go. So I wanna do coaching first. So let's talk about coaching first.

'cause speaking. I can get you rolling on that pretty quick. Okay. Let's talk about coaching, because in coaching, we all know this, right? The coaching world is. Really saturated. And a lot of people will tell you, well, it's not you though. Right? And they're a hundred percent correct. Right? You are for people and you are not for other people, and that's okay.

And Jen, [00:16:00] your energy, I know you're okay with it. I'm the same way I am. I am not for everybody, but I am for people and that's a good thing, right? Mm-hmm. So I would ask you this, so in the coaching that you've done and in the help that you've gotten, what are some things that you have tried that have not worked for you and or have worked for you?

In a nutshell, if you could share those with us, because I think it helps give a landscape to the audience as well as we learn together. Yeah, so one program that I really liked talked about fractals, and from a simplicity point, because I'm all about efficiency, I don't like wasting time, I don't like doing things over and over again.

So the idea of a fractal, something that's repeatable is beautiful, right? And so the five main fractals, if I can remember them, is direct outreach, referrals, networking. Writing and then speaking. And so I really have been focusing on LinkedIn, being more consistent with that. And , sure. I just [00:17:00] got a new person from Europe whose sister found me on LinkedIn, so yes, that's great.

But one person, you know, every six or eight months probably isn't going to cut the mustard there. Right. I don't love writing, so I don't do a whole lot of blogs. I do like networking. But I'm curious about maybe I need to shift my networking to get to this bigger audience. Yep. Is that a good overview for you?

Perfect. Yep. I know where you are now. Perfect. So yeah, a couple things. I would, um, definitely start suggesting one. I love that you're on LinkedIn. A lot of people miss that, especially because of you who you are. So this is for you, Jen, anyone listening when there's certain platforms as we know for different things, right?

You've got a wealth of knowledge and you've got 35 years under your belt. A LinkedIn audience is one you don't wanna miss out on. Right? So I would look for communities on LinkedIn [00:18:00] that would connect you in kind of the pain and wellness space. So I don't know if you are in those communities, but I would tap into that.

I would also keep posting and become. Like this person. I know you don't love writing, but it doesn't have to be anything crazy. I would post consistently on LinkedIn, but not to a point where it fatigues you, because I do think being a professional at your level, that's going to be a good community for you to build.

So get into groups that are talking about pain and wellness and that kind of management so that people get to know you and participate. That's one thing I would do. The next thing I would do is sometimes my people get sick of me talking about this, but Facebook is a gold mine. Are you a Facebook lover or hater?

I have to ask. I'm trying to evolve my relationship with Facebook, so we're gonna try to do that today. I'm gonna challenge you for that today, Jen. And here's why. Here's why Facebook groups are a gold mine, okay? The reality is that. [00:19:00] I don't really use Facebook other than groups. I love running groups. I love growing groups, and I love being a part of groups.

One thing that a lot of people will tell you though, is like you can't go into a group and just like say, hi, I'm Jen. I coach and drop your link. That's where a lot of people get discouraged too. They're like, well, I'm promoting. I'm promoting, and every time I have this conversation with people, I'm like, what do you mean by you're promoting?

Like they're dropping their link in and they're saying what they do instead. I want you, Jen, and anyone listening to this that hasn't utilized Facebook groups to get in the groups where your people are. So I don't want you to hang out in groups where other wellness professionals are, where other PT professionals are.

Right. Anything like we don't need, you can connect with them another time over a cocktail or a coffee, right? No problem. Mm-hmm. I want you to go where your people will be, right. Where your person is, and sometimes that takes some time to step back and think, [00:20:00] okay, where are these pain people?

Where are they hanging out? Right? What kind of groups are they hanging out in? There's a plethora of them out there, right? Like you can go to like, I'm dealing with this type of pain group. I'm dealing, join them, join those groups, and get active in those groups. Get curious when people are posting, ask them instead of just posting the link.

Because when people do that, it's too impersonal, especially for what you're doing. You are creating a deep connection, and I know you can do it, Jen, because. People are inviting you into their homes and you have just met them, or you just got to know them, right? So that's not a challenge for you. I think getting in the archetype environments, the archetype of the person you wanna help, that's what's going to help you.

But building those relationships in there. So when someone's posting in the group saying, I've been dealing with this pain for 20 years, you can post right back and say, oh, hi. Maya. Wow. Tell me [00:21:00] a little bit more about this. Make it about them and make those connections, because quickly you'll rise in those groups.

And then in addition to that, create your own Facebook group. Grow your own Facebook group, because then that's when you start dropping your links. That's when you start promoting your, maybe you do a live every week or every other week, and you start pulling those people from those pain groups. Are all, 'cause we also know what happens in these groups, guys.

'cause I have grief groups. Okay? So pain groups I find to be similar. They start to trauma dump on each other, right? Am I right, Jen, or am I right? Right. Percent. So when you can extract them from those groups and pull them and start creating your own community, that's what I want you to do. You're gonna create a, basically it's a free community, and then that's gonna turn into a paid community for you.

So you're basically building that and it's building that trust. So you're gonna use other groups in a respectful way, right? And connecting with them, pull them into your own group. Another thing I like to mention too, when I [00:22:00] start talking to people about Facebook groups, and you can create a group on LinkedIn as well, so both of these strategies can work.

And if I were you, I'd focus on these two areas just by, based on what you're doing. Got it. And make sure the name, what you name the group. Is very easy for people. 'cause when people search for groups on Facebook, right, if we, if we name it like your name, they're not gonna know what that is. But if you're like, help with, you know, physical pain or extended like something in your face, and then you can brand the group with your own stuff, okay?

Once they're in the group and then you have them there and you're helping them and you're in the group and you're present on a daily basis and it doesn't take a lot. That's what's nice about it. It's almost like a Twitter or a short feed. You can just post something and get people talking and you're creating a community, and you're also creating relationships with each other.

That would be the first thing out of the gate that I would do if I were you today, I would start doing this, connecting in the groups, creating your own group, and then you're feeding them into. You could even create, this [00:23:00] is an idea for you too, Jen. You could create a paid community on something like a school or a circle or one of these platforms where they're paying a low fee every month.

Whatever you're comfortable with, where you are engaging with them on a daily basis because there is a monetary commitment for it and it's also a safe. Environment. You're pulling them out of a very public environment like LinkedIn or Facebook, and you're now creating a community where they can trauma dump and they can open up, but you're also creating solutions for them.

That's where you could put, you know, you were sharing with me before we hit record, that you've done, videos and sessions and different things. You could create all of this there, but you have to, you're gonna get burnt out if you don't create like. Get in the Facebook groups, get in the LinkedIn groups, feed it into your own group, and then create a paid community because that's gonna start filtering in different folks for you to build your business and it's organic.

It costs $0 for [00:24:00] you to do any of this except for purchasing the platform that you will do. But that'll be a couple dollars a month and you'll have people on it paying for that. I already have a Kajabi community. I'm happy to tell you. Then you're already, then nobody does anything in there. That's what you need to do.

So it's, you have that, so you're set up, you need to work on these free organic paths to get them into your own groups and then get them onto your Kajabi. 'cause right now you don't have anything feeding into that. Right, some something. So that's one thing. Another thing. So again, that's a no brainer for me.

Talk to me about other social media. Are you on platforms like Instagram, TikTok? Are you doing anything like that? I did Instagram. I hit it hard for several months. It didn't seem to be worth the time and energy and, um, my business manager and I, we are rethinking starting Instagram again. So that's my answer.

So here's my advice on [00:25:00] Instagram and people, again, you guys are probably gonna be like, oh my, here she goes again. Instagram is super aesthetic, right? So I would keep those posts to informational and aesthetically pleasing. Um, that's the strategy that works for most people because that's Instagram.

Instagram was founded, you know, years ago, but it hit it hard about a decade ago, right? It's very aesthetically pleasing. People. Were scrolling for pictures, right? Reels are popular now. They've been popular for a few years. Um, TikTok is something I would also consider. Here's why. It's absolutely the most powerful live tool out there right now because you can go and you can build an audience and you can talk, speak to them live, and you can convert them live into your community, into your Facebook group.

Into places like that. So it's something I would talk to your business manager about or start, start signing up, start playing with it, start engaging with people. It's really easy because of how their algorithm is built to connect with your audience. I [00:26:00] wouldn't beat your head against the wall with Instagram, I would do what you need to do to have a presence, because we have to in this day and age.

Mm-hmm. Right. I would explore the option about maybe getting a little more engaged on TikTok, but I really would hit it hard with the LinkedIn strategy and the Facebook strategy. That's where I would go with social and then tearing it down like that. As far as networking opportunities, I would and you have to tell me if this is something you've done where we go to these like women's networking things, thinking that we're gonna get clients.

Have you done a lot of these, like women networking, women virtual events, things like that? Or what has been your experience with that? I had already learned that those do not foster much. They don't, I did for one year, I did, not better Business bureau. Chamber of Commerce. I did the local Chamber of Commerce.

That turned into a couple things. Yeah, I don't know. So for your type of business, it's not going to be the most lucrative. Where I would look for you is getting involved in like networking or [00:27:00] meetup events for people that have the problem you're trying to solve and the problem you're trying to solve is pain.

So that's where I would look. You can. Pull up good old Google. You can also, again, Facebook will find this too, but different things you can look on. Eventbrite, you can look on things, go to the events where the people are having the problem that you are trying to solve. And this is for anyone listening, right?

Sometimes I think we get, when it's our own business, sometimes we think, 'cause for many years too, I did the same thing. I went to every like entrepreneurial networking thing and this and that. Just hoping someone for my event business, hoping someone was gonna do an event, hoping someone, and I'm like.

Wait a second. I'm like, I need to go where people go and I specialize in nonprofit and tech events. I'm like, I need to go to tech events. I need to go to nonprofit events where not executive directors are things changed very quickly when I did that instead because then, if I'm in a room with a hundred executive directors, chances are most of them are doing events.

[00:28:00] Chances are some of them aren't having a great solution. So it's just about reframing sometimes, Jen. So think about, and you're gonna know this much better, but think even going to, uh, you don't have to go out and go to a conference, but like going to virtual meetups, right? For pain and people that are struggling with that, and you can go to those and connect with those people.

And I don't mean in a pitch way, right? Like you're going, but you're going to build a connection so that you can solve a solution for them. It's about getting in front of the people that are having the problem that you're trying to solve. So that's another thing that I would do and then just keep following down that path as well.

The other thing I would also do from the LinkedIn perspective and then any other social perspective that you're doing is really focus on giving information, right? Because I think sometimes, and I think you'll do this quite well and you probably already do it really well, but just kind of as a blanket thing for this.

I think sometimes we talk a [00:29:00] lot about like what we're doing versus like, here's a problem that's being solved, right? And for you, this is like how this problem was solved. Testimonials will be great for you as well to have some of those, um, from some of the folks that you have worked with. But that's how I could see you building.

Pipeline for your coaching, right, is getting in those groups socially, networking and also other, think of other professionals that you could. This is the only way I would go this way instead of just like Chamber of Commerce, things like that. It's not gonna be as effective as going about it this way. I would go about partnering with potential people that maybe deal with folks in physical pain all the time, right?

That are looking for someone that can kind of carry them across the finish line. And you would know that better than me being in this space. But those are the kind of partnerships we're looking for versus like. You know, your, your local, you know, your mayor or like things like that that you have at like a chamber of commerce.

I think you're [00:30:00] gonna find more depth in those types of networking circles, if that makes sense. That does make sense. Thank you. You're welcome. You're welcome. So before we talk a little bit more about where do people find you, because. Someone might be listening that wants your services. I think you're phenomenal.

Where were you five years ago? When my back pain was at an ultimate awful, you wanted to talk about speaking engagements as well? Yes. Talk to me a little bit about, what, like what are you looking for? You want, obviously we all wanna be paid to speak, right? So what kind of audiences are you wanting to speak to?

I would assume. Pain management conferences and things like that is where you would wanna go. But you tell me, what are you focusing on? What are you targeting? Yeah, so I actually would prefer to not be in the academic conference world because there's a high level of science and honestly, yes, I have 35 years experience.

I just have my good old bachelor's degree and so, you know, they're looking for people with PhDs and [00:31:00] DPTs and all that. So that's not the conference I'm looking for. I'm looking to actually reach the person who is struggling with pain. Right now, and that's why I've been directing it that way. I was in a program for a year really working to get into colleges and there were a lot of leads, but nothing came through.

I have spoken at a couple of conferences. Interestingly, I spoke at a divorce conference. I did a program for a veterinarian group. So the reality is that. Pain is a universal human experience, so I can cater and find something to match every audience depending on what their needs are. So sure.

Perfect. It's a vague answer, but yeah. No, it's not. It's not a vague answer. So one thing I would say is I would, my advice to you or my opinion as we talk about here, get very clear on who you wanna talk to. Because the more you, I think it's [00:32:00] great that you've had these speaking engagements, but the more that you are kind of ambiguous or not more ambiguous, but you can kind of shift the audience.

The less clear it's going to be on who you actually serve. I want you to be, 'cause I feel like with your coaching, you're very clear on who you serve. I feel like with your PT practice, you're very clear on who you serve. I feel like just from what you've shared about the speaking, you are willing to kind of be a little bit more of a chameleon.

To speak, but I don't think you're gonna get the results that you want from that. Right? And a paid speaking gig is a paid speaking gig. And it's great in the beginning, and it gives you practice, but as you're growing, you're not gonna have the bandwidth for that anymore. Jen, we're putting that out there, right?

So get, get very clear and from our conversation today. I think you really want to get to that individual. You really wanna get to that individual who is struggling with pain that has manifested from something physical, maybe evolved in because of emotional, like that's what you're telling me and telling all of us.

So I want [00:33:00] you to get in front of that person and you don't have to hire, I have some, some good friends that run speaking management companies, so guys, don't kill me. But you don't have to hire someone to do that for you when you're at a place where. You are so busy, like you can't manage it anymore.

Wonderful. It's great to have those folks, but right now, I would challenge you to be very strategic when you're networking in these groups of folks who have struggled with pain. Like, I don't know, maybe you go speak to a bunch of people who have fibromyalgia. Maybe you go to speak to a bunch of people who have, you know, I mean, I'm making this up, but those are the types of people.

Identify those groups. Spend some time. I'm a huge chat, GPT Funky Chunk Junkie. I don't know if you are too tight. Go. Go to chat pt, what are the top events for people struggling with, physical pain? And talk to chat GPT and say, you know, I'm not saying I, these are the, I don't want the professionals that help with it.

I want the actual people. Where do they go? Where do they connect? It's like grief conferences, [00:34:00] right? They happen usually annually and bereaved parents meet up, bereaved, you know, moms, dads bere, bereaved pet parents. All these people, they have meetups. Where are these people with struggling with physical pain?

What are those events? Those are the ones I want you reaching out to and, inquiring about and showing your one pager to them. And, I think you're gonna see massive different results at that point too, Jen. Awesome. I love that. Thank you. Yeah. And fun fact for you, 30% of people with chronic pain have never had an injury or a surgery.

So emotional overload is enough to create the physical experience of pain. I'm not surprised. I am not surprised at all. So, you know, that might be something to also explore because of the, so maybe you're going to some of these conferences where there's a big emotional event that has happened to create physical pain that's also gonna 30%, that's a huge chunk for that to be your client as well, Jen.

And isn't that [00:35:00] validating? Like intuitively you knew and now. Like, oh, so isn't it cool that now we know that that's actual thing? Yeah, because too many people in pain are told it's all in their head, do not like it. Oh, yeah. Oh yeah. I was told that in, in grief 'cause it physically manifested for me, which is why I use those examples.

Yeah, I mean it's dismissed quite often and I think it's very validating and hopefully validating for you guys listening. As well, Jen, I hope some of this is helpful for you so you can go and apply this. It's helpful. Yeah, I'm excited to, just sit and chew on a little bit and then take some action.

Well, Jen, tell us where we can find you. Tell us, again, your website. It's all gonna be linked in the show notes, guys, so you can connect with Jen, make sure you follow Jen. We'll put all of that, in the notes below. But yeah, Jen, take it away. Tell us where we can find you. Yeah, excellent. I'm very active on LinkedIn, so you can just find me with my name and then my website is.

Jen ul.com and I recently created something called the Painless Toolkit and it's really just a set of cards where it's [00:36:00] just one little message about any number of topics around pain. And so if you want, I can send you the link 'cause I have a free mini version of that and people can get a little bit curious about that and explore the website a little bit.

But those are the best and easiest places to find me. Well, that will also be in the notes below. Yes, Jen, please send that to us. Thank you on behalf of all of us. I can't wait to check that out. It's a wonderful thing that you're doing. I love a good freebie as my audience knows, right? Give us a little taste of what you're doing and also some information.

So that's fabulous. I hope this was helpful, Jen. Keep us posted. Let us know where you're going. I hope folks will reach out to you and, thanks for being on the show. Very helpful and I'm quite appreciative, so thank you. Yes, my pleasure. And thank you guys so much for listening to the MaYapinion Podcast.

We'll see you back on the next episode. [00:37:00]